BF% to start

Topic created · 16 Posts · 499 Views
  • Hi everyone,

    Very new here, but not to training. I’ve spent the last couple years training very consistently, aside from being out for injuries, taking my bench from 135×8 kind of hard to 225x5 with ease (havent tried to go heavier yet, still too new imo for it to be useful, Just focusing on volume mostly), squat ~200×8->335x2, deadlift 225×8->385x5. I’ve dropped about 100 pounds from 350->260. Currently I’m 5’9" 260lbs with a 50" waist at my navel, so putting me around 35% BF based upon calculators. I know you want to be lean before starting your first cycle, but how lean? I’m sure if my diet was on point and training was on point I’d see great gains, but being I’m natural, I want to see as much gain as as possible from my first pin because it will be a new stimulus my body hasn’t experienced.

  • There’s no rule to it but some people will play gatekeeper and tell you that you shouldn’t start unless you’re 10-12% body fat or lower. Thing is, most of those people aren’t even that lean with the gear let alone before they started. It’s some dumb shit that the internet hive mind cooked up years ago. Personally I think if you’re an adult and can accept the consequences of your actions then go ahead and do whatever you want. Gear will not magically make you leaner, stronger or bigger though so you’re still doing all the work. If this ruins the appeal for you, then don’t bother going down the rabbit hole.

  • [quote=“Animutiddies” pid=‘65062’ dateline=‘1565889761’]
    There’s no rule to it but some people will play gatekeeper and tell you that you shouldn’t start unless you’re 10-12% body fat or lower. Thing is, most of those people aren’t even that lean with the gear let alone before they started. It’s some dumb shit that the internet hive mind cooked up years ago. Personally I think if you’re an adult and can accept the consequences of your actions then go ahead and do whatever you want. Gear will not magically make you leaner, stronger or bigger though so you’re still doing all the work. If this ruins the appeal for you, then don’t bother going down the rabbit hole.
    [/quote]

    Aside from vanity, I want to run gear so I can recover faster and train more than I am now. I run a 3/week full body routine and if i run gear maybe i could throw in an extra day or two and not feel like a zombie or that i can lift anything.

  • From what I’ve gathered just from reading through the forum I’ve heard a lot of people say to be at least sub 20%. I’m no expert or anything close. From what they say the higher your body fat % the more the gear will aromatize.

  • [quote=“thaatkiid6813” pid=‘65066’ dateline=‘1565890701’]
    From what I’ve gathered just from reading through the forum I’ve heard a lot of people say to be at least sub 20%. I’m no expert or anything close. From what they say the higher your body fat % the more the gear will aromatize.
    [/quote]

    Yea that’s what I’m afraid of. I saw a dude on reddit who had a comparable physique to myself and he blasted for a year and looks good now, but I dont want to have to be on a heavy cycle for an entire year because so much of my extra test is being aromatized.

  • [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65060’ dateline=‘1565888850’]
    Hi everyone,

    Very new here, but not to training. I’ve spent the last couple years training very consistently, aside from being out for injuries, taking my bench from 135×8 kind of hard to 225x5 with ease (havent tried to go heavier yet, still too new imo for it to be useful, Just focusing on volume mostly), squat ~200×8->335x2, deadlift 225×8->385x5. I’ve dropped about 100 pounds from 350->260. Currently I’m 5’9" 260lbs with a 50" waist at my navel, so putting me around 35% BF based upon calculators. I know you want to be lean before starting your first cycle, but how lean? I’m sure if my diet was on point and training was on point I’d see great gains, but being I’m natural, I want to see as much gain as as possible from my first pin because it will be a new stimulus my body hasn’t experienced.
    [/quote]

    Hey man, you’re going to do what you’re going to do regardless so I’m going to give you some advice should you decide to hop on.

    First, get blood work done. Check your natural test levels etc.

    If everythng looks good, I would recommend a low dose of Test, around 250mg a week while you cut. This will help you preserve muscle in a deficit.

    Make sure your diet is in order, however you decide to do so, whether it be low carb, high carb, low fat etc. Make sure you’re getting enough protein and LOG EVERYTHING YOU EAT to make sure you are staying under your calorie limit. That butter you just put on that toast? Yeah log that fucking butter.

    Pay attention to your body, watch for water retention, itchy nips etc. If you truly are at 35% BF you’re probably gonna have e2 issues even at a lower Test dose so please for the love of God have an AI like Adex or Asin (I prefer Asin) on hand.

    Make sure you’re lifting hard, and make sure you’re doing plenty of cardio and I promise you’ll notice a difference. Once your BF% gets lower, then I’d start adding shit.

    Get bloodwork done midway through your cycle to check your e2 and shit because you’re probably gonna aromatize like a bitch, even at 250mg so you’re gonna want to make sure you get that shit dialed in and on point.

  • [quote=“thallandchill” pid=‘65069’ dateline=‘1565892880’]
    [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65060’ dateline=‘1565888850’]
    Hi everyone,

    Very new here, but not to training. I’ve spent the last couple years training very consistently, aside from being out for injuries, taking my bench from 135×8 kind of hard to 225x5 with ease (havent tried to go heavier yet, still too new imo for it to be useful, Just focusing on volume mostly), squat ~200×8->335x2, deadlift 225×8->385x5. I’ve dropped about 100 pounds from 350->260. Currently I’m 5’9" 260lbs with a 50" waist at my navel, so putting me around 35% BF based upon calculators. I know you want to be lean before starting your first cycle, but how lean? I’m sure if my diet was on point and training was on point I’d see great gains, but being I’m natural, I want to see as much gain as as possible from my first pin because it will be a new stimulus my body hasn’t experienced.
    [/quote]

    Hey man, you’re going to do what you’re going to do regardless so I’m going to give you some advice should you decide to hop on.

    First, get blood work done. Check your natural test levels etc.

    If everythng looks good, I would recommend a low dose of Test, around 250mg a week while you cut. This will help you preserve muscle in a deficit.

    Make sure your diet is in order, however you decide to do so, whether it be low carb, high carb, low fat etc. Make sure you’re getting enough protein and LOG EVERYTHING YOU EAT to make sure you are staying under your calorie limit. That butter you just put on that toast? Yeah log that fucking butter.

    Pay attention to your body, watch for water retention, itchy nips etc. If you truly are at 35% BF you’re probably gonna have e2 issues even at a lower Test dose so please for the love of God have an AI like Adex or Asin (I prefer Asin) on hand.

    Make sure you’re lifting hard, and make sure you’re doing plenty of cardio and I promise you’ll notice a difference. Once your BF% gets lower, then I’d start adding shit.

    Get bloodwork done midway through your cycle to check your e2 and shit because you’re probably gonna aromatize like a bitch, even at 250mg so you’re gonna want to make sure you get that shit dialed in and on point.
    [/quote]

    So what you’re telling me is that it’s fine to run test while cutting? I was probably going to pin on the 1st Oct and soend the rest of these next weeks seriously cutting so hopefully I might be 240ish by the time I decide to hop on. But if I have an AI I’ll be fine, most likely? I’m gonna diet regardless until october.

  • [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65070’ dateline=‘1565893280’]
    [quote=“thallandchill” pid=‘65069’ dateline=‘1565892880’]
    [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65060’ dateline=‘1565888850’]
    Hi everyone,

    Very new here, but not to training. I’ve spent the last couple years training very consistently, aside from being out for injuries, taking my bench from 135×8 kind of hard to 225x5 with ease (havent tried to go heavier yet, still too new imo for it to be useful, Just focusing on volume mostly), squat ~200×8->335x2, deadlift 225×8->385x5. I’ve dropped about 100 pounds from 350->260. Currently I’m 5’9" 260lbs with a 50" waist at my navel, so putting me around 35% BF based upon calculators. I know you want to be lean before starting your first cycle, but how lean? I’m sure if my diet was on point and training was on point I’d see great gains, but being I’m natural, I want to see as much gain as as possible from my first pin because it will be a new stimulus my body hasn’t experienced.
    [/quote]

    Hey man, you’re going to do what you’re going to do regardless so I’m going to give you some advice should you decide to hop on.

    First, get blood work done. Check your natural test levels etc.

    If everythng looks good, I would recommend a low dose of Test, around 250mg a week while you cut. This will help you preserve muscle in a deficit.

    Make sure your diet is in order, however you decide to do so, whether it be low carb, high carb, low fat etc. Make sure you’re getting enough protein and LOG EVERYTHING YOU EAT to make sure you are staying under your calorie limit. That butter you just put on that toast? Yeah log that fucking butter.

    Pay attention to your body, watch for water retention, itchy nips etc. If you truly are at 35% BF you’re probably gonna have e2 issues even at a lower Test dose so please for the love of God have an AI like Adex or Asin (I prefer Asin) on hand.

    Make sure you’re lifting hard, and make sure you’re doing plenty of cardio and I promise you’ll notice a difference. Once your BF% gets lower, then I’d start adding shit.

    Get bloodwork done midway through your cycle to check your e2 and shit because you’re probably gonna aromatize like a bitch, even at 250mg so you’re gonna want to make sure you get that shit dialed in and on point.
    [/quote]

    So what you’re telling me is that it’s fine to run test while cutting? I was probably going to pin on the 1st Oct and soend the rest of these next weeks seriously cutting so hopefully I might be 240ish by the time I decide to hop on. But if I have an AI I’ll be fine, most likely? I’m gonna diet regardless until october.
    [/quote]

    As long as you have an AI on hand and you pay attention to your body, you’re going to be fine running Test while cutting, even at that % of BF.

    ( I am not doctor, and this is not medical advice. This is purely based off of what I’ve seen. I’ve had friends jump on gear at that body fat % and are perfectly fine and look 100x’s better than before )

  • [quote=“thallandchill” pid=‘65071’ dateline=‘1565893478’]
    [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65070’ dateline=‘1565893280’]
    [quote=“thallandchill” pid=‘65069’ dateline=‘1565892880’]
    [quote=“ProfessorNas” pid=‘65060’ dateline=‘1565888850’]
    Hi everyone,

    Very new here, but not to training. I’ve spent the last couple years training very consistently, aside from being out for injuries, taking my bench from 135×8 kind of hard to 225x5 with ease (havent tried to go heavier yet, still too new imo for it to be useful, Just focusing on volume mostly), squat ~200×8->335x2, deadlift 225×8->385x5. I’ve dropped about 100 pounds from 350->260. Currently I’m 5’9" 260lbs with a 50" waist at my navel, so putting me around 35% BF based upon calculators. I know you want to be lean before starting your first cycle, but how lean? I’m sure if my diet was on point and training was on point I’d see great gains, but being I’m natural, I want to see as much gain as as possible from my first pin because it will be a new stimulus my body hasn’t experienced.
    [/quote]

    Hey man, you’re going to do what you’re going to do regardless so I’m going to give you some advice should you decide to hop on.

    First, get blood work done. Check your natural test levels etc.

    If everythng looks good, I would recommend a low dose of Test, around 250mg a week while you cut. This will help you preserve muscle in a deficit.

    Make sure your diet is in order, however you decide to do so, whether it be low carb, high carb, low fat etc. Make sure you’re getting enough protein and LOG EVERYTHING YOU EAT to make sure you are staying under your calorie limit. That butter you just put on that toast? Yeah log that fucking butter.

    Pay attention to your body, watch for water retention, itchy nips etc. If you truly are at 35% BF you’re probably gonna have e2 issues even at a lower Test dose so please for the love of God have an AI like Adex or Asin (I prefer Asin) on hand.

    Make sure you’re lifting hard, and make sure you’re doing plenty of cardio and I promise you’ll notice a difference. Once your BF% gets lower, then I’d start adding shit.

    Get bloodwork done midway through your cycle to check your e2 and shit because you’re probably gonna aromatize like a bitch, even at 250mg so you’re gonna want to make sure you get that shit dialed in and on point.
    [/quote]

    So what you’re telling me is that it’s fine to run test while cutting? I was probably going to pin on the 1st Oct and soend the rest of these next weeks seriously cutting so hopefully I might be 240ish by the time I decide to hop on. But if I have an AI I’ll be fine, most likely? I’m gonna diet regardless until october.
    [/quote]

    As long as you have an AI on hand and you pay attention to your body, you’re going to be fine running Test while cutting, even at that % of BF.

    ( I am not doctor, and this is not medical advice. This is purely based off of what I’ve seen. I’ve had friends jump on gear at that body fat % and are perfectly fine and look 100x’s better than before )
    [/quote]

    Thanks for the advice and tha is for the disclaimer lmao

  • I’d recommend you control your diet before starting. I do recommend you stock up on everything you need and have it in place when you eventually start your cycle. Most importantly don’t forget to stock up on plenty of AI (aromasin)

    The problem with Test is that you probably won’t lose any weight from it. If anything you’ll probably gain 10 to 20 pounds.

    First get your hormones checked with labs, Total and Free Test, E2, and see where you stand.

    Then find a way to restrict your calories. No amount of exercise will make up for excess calories. I spend an hour 6 days a week doing cardio and lifting four days a week on top of that, I could blow all that work in just minutes eating high calorie garbage.

    The fastest I ever dumped weight was 68 pounds in three months doing fours hours of cardio everyday, two hours in the morning and two in the afternoon. I lived on less then 1000 calories a day, ate mostly greens(kale, collards, spinach), other veggies, and lean meat. Stayed away from all junk. It was a living hell, but it paid off eventually as i felt fantastic going from 240 eventually down to 168.

    It’s much much easier to control the side effects of your cycle if your lean.

    Remember most of the guys in body building and powerlifting died because they were F’n huge, the bigger you are the more strain it puts on your heart. All these guys that have killed over seem to all have this one thing in common.

  • [quote=“Dexter” pid=‘65075’ dateline=‘1565894876’]
    I’d recommend you control your diet before starting. I do recommend you stock up on everything you need and have it in place when you eventually start your cycle. Most importantly don’t forget to stock up on plenty of AI (aromasin)

    The problem with Test is that you probably won’t lose any weight from it. If anything you’ll probably gain 10 to 20 pounds.

    First get your hormones checked with labs, Total and Free Test, E2, and see where you stand.

    Then find a way to restrict your calories. No amount of exercise will make up for excess calories. I spend an hour 6 days a week doing cardio and lifting four days a week on top of that, I could blow all that work in just minutes eating high calorie garbage.

    The fastest I ever dumped weight was 68 pounds in three months doing fours hours of cardio everyday, two hours in the morning and two in the afternoon. I lived on less then 1000 calories a day, ate mostly greens(kale, collards, spinach), other veggies, and lean meat. Stayed away from all junk. It was a living hell, but it paid off eventually as i felt fantastic going from 240 eventually down to 168.

    It’s much much easier to control the side effects of your cycle if your lean.

    Remember most of the guys in body building and powerlifting died because they were F’n huge, the bigger you are the more strain it puts on your heart. All these guys that have killed over seem to all have this one thing in common.
    [/quote]

    U tryna tell me imma die from being fuckin’ yuge m8?

  • first of all… props on your current transformation from 350 to 260. that is admirable and took a lot of dedication.

    imo, i wouldn’t hop on gear yet. my focus would be to implement a plan that gets you in the gym 5 days a week instead of 3. that probably means going from a full-body routine to bodybuilding split. get your diet in check and do cardio 3x a week. drop down to where you’ve got abs so you can see how much muscle you’ve got. you will feel better, your body will function more efficiently. you will also have a grasp on diet and training.

    once i did that i would look at getting on cycle… if you are consistent it would probably take 8 months or so to reach that point.

    …but that’s just my opinion so feel free to ignore me and do whatever the fuck you wanna do!!!

  • Less fat = less aromatization

  • ThallandChill has pretty good advice: it all boils down to you’ll do what you want to do.

    To add to what’s been said; AAS is bad on the heart and depending on compound cholesterol/lipids (again heart). Considering you’re still quite a bit overweight and your progress is pretty steady I would get to a better cardiovascular state of being (leaner/ more low intensity cardio) and as was said before make sure your health markers are good before starting (blood pressure/lipids/cbc/optionally liver enzymes); I’d say you’d still be building muscle while losing weight for a long time assuming you’re not going to be starving yourself which is a good deterrent on just starting AAS use right away as the only point to throwing in testosterone is to hold onto/build more muscle which on a deficit isn’t really ideal for growing considering you’d want to make this your lifestyle I would wait til sub 20% atleast - me, personally sub 10% but most likely people get antsy - I probably would too.

    If you don’t believe me you can also take time investing in watching coach Greg Doucette’s videos on youtube; he has some good content/knowledge being put out.

  • Thanks for the advice everyone. I definitely will take all of this into consideration.

  • People gate-keep and say around 15% and being able to move a certain amount of weight because it shows dedication more than anything. I know too many people who expect steroids to do 90% of the work and they suck at lifting and eating.

    That said, if you feel dedicated and like you can actually stick with it, then go for it. Be prepared for going heavy on the AI to account for the extra aromatization, and as you lose weight you’ll probably have to adjust it. Get bloods fairly often, and honestly, don’t be surprised if even after everything you have gyno you’ll have to get taken care of. Though to be fair, if you’re that large you may already have it, just hidden under the fat. Only time will tell.

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