I’m an advocate for IF and leangains

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  • Hey all. I could not find any topics on this so making my own. I’ve been doing intermittent fasting and lean gains for years. Am I screwed doing intermittent fasting with compounds such as Test, tren, primo etc? I never hear about IF With aas.

    I also train with reverse pyramid training with a few isolation exercises 4 days a week and got great results with it. Would I need to change my routine ? Because With aas I was simply going to just raise the sets.

  • Why would it not work in conjunction with aas

  • IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha

  • [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62062’ dateline=‘1563894156’]
    IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha
    [/quote]

    Would I still benefit from bcaa post workouts? I know the 6 meals a day thing is broscience for naturals lol
    [hr]
    [quote=“propionate” pid=‘62061’ dateline=‘1563892201’]
    Why would it not work in conjunction with aas
    [/quote]

    Since muscles on aas are in a constant anabolic state so feeding more often would be beneficial.

  • AAS makes fasting more effective afaik. Especially GH prior to fasted training and following up your postWO meal with insulin

  • [quote=“jxl2008” pid=‘62063’ dateline=‘1563894846’]
    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62062’ dateline=‘1563894156’]
    IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha
    [/quote]

    Would I still benefit from bcaa post workouts? I know the 6 meals a day thing is broscience for naturals lol
    [hr]
    [quote=“propionate” pid=‘62061’ dateline=‘1563892201’]
    Why would it not work in conjunction with aas
    [/quote]

    Since muscles on aas are in a constant anabolic state so feeding more often would be beneficial.
    [/quote]

    BCAA’s are trash so you’re not good at trolling or missed all the memos of the last decade

  • [quote=“jxl2008” pid=‘62063’ dateline=‘1563894846’]
    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62062’ dateline=‘1563894156’]
    IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha
    [/quote]

    Would I still benefit from bcaa post workouts? I know the 6 meals a day thing is broscience for naturals lol
    [hr]
    [quote=“propionate” pid=‘62061’ dateline=‘1563892201’]
    Why would it not work in conjunction with aas
    [/quote]

    Since muscles on aas are in a constant anabolic state so feeding more often would be beneficial.
    [/quote]

    How is eating 6 meals a day bro science…?

  • I have done a IF eating schedule for years. I eat from 530pm to 10pm, fast every other hour.

    I’ve made gains even though my window is small. I eat so much at one time, food digests much longer. May not be the most ideal, but I like it.

  • I’ve been doing it for years too. Works fine on gear. The only compound I’ve taken where I had to drop it was superdrol, because it made me go kind of hypo. I just drank a half gallon of fairlife chocolate milk and that took care of me until my usual eating window. I experienced this to a lesser extent on tren, and I’d have to have candy bar or something. It’s not like the world ends, or anything of note, really–happens if you break your arbitrary window.

    I don’t care whether or not it’s ideal at this point, as a former fatty who loves to eat it helps me keep me in control of my diet whether I’m cutting, bulking or maintaining. I find it especially helpful with the latter two—when people are like “how could you bulk on IF?” I’m like, um “I like food.”

    I find the leangains macro protocols to be too much for me to follow, but the 16/8 window and Martin’s approach to training have done me a lot of good.
    [hr]
    I don’t, however, think it’s for everybody. I think it’s ideal for people who hear “skip breakfast, have a light lunch and a huge dinner” and think “oh shit, that sounds amazing!” Compliance>Anything else. I’m past the point of caring about what its benefits or drawbacks are. Greg Doucette, whose videos on gear I like, just put out a “IF is terrible!” video and I’m like “whatever, maybe he’s right. It does the job fine for me. If I eat six small meals a day, or don’t have a giant man meal at 7 I’m not gonna be happy and I’m gonna fall of the wagon sooner or later.”

  • [quote=“nlite2k” pid=‘62128’ dateline=‘1563927628’]
    I’ve been doing it for years too. Works fine on gear. The only compound I’ve taken where I had to drop it was superdrol, because it made me go kind of hypo. I just drank a half gallon of fairlife chocolate milk and that took care of me until my usual eating window. I experienced this to a lesser extent on tren, and I’d have to have candy bar or something. It’s not like the world ends, or anything of note, really–happens if you break your arbitrary window.

    I don’t care whether or not it’s ideal at this point, as a former fatty who loves to eat it helps me keep me in control of my diet whether I’m cutting, bulking or maintaining. I find it especially helpful with the latter two—when people are like “how could you bulk on IF?” I’m like, um “I like food.”

    I find the leangains macro protocols to be too much for me to follow, but the 16/8 window and Martin’s approach to training have done me a lot of good.
    [hr]
    I don’t, however, think it’s for everybody. I think it’s ideal for people who hear “skip breakfast, have a light lunch and a huge dinner” and think “oh shit, that sounds amazing!” Compliance>Anything else. I’m past the point of caring about what its benefits or drawbacks are. Greg Doucette, whose videos on gear I like, just put out a “IF is terrible!” video and I’m like “whatever, maybe he’s right. It does the job fine for me. If I eat six small meals a day, or don’t have a giant man meal at 7 I’m not gonna be happy and I’m gonna fall of the wagon sooner or later.”
    [/quote]

    Hahah I know the struggle. I even suffer from binge eating disorder and IF keeps it tamed. I get so annoyed hearing people trying IF and complain about being full all the time especially while on a fricken cut.

    I’m surprised about the tren. I thought tren would be the ideal compound for a past fatty like myself. Since it’s notorious for burining so much fat

  • [quote=“jxl2008” pid=‘62131’ dateline=‘1563929787’]
    [quote=“nlite2k” pid=‘62128’ dateline=‘1563927628’]
    I’ve been doing it for years too. Works fine on gear. The only compound I’ve taken where I had to drop it was superdrol, because it made me go kind of hypo. I just drank a half gallon of fairlife chocolate milk and that took care of me until my usual eating window. I experienced this to a lesser extent on tren, and I’d have to have candy bar or something. It’s not like the world ends, or anything of note, really–happens if you break your arbitrary window.

    I don’t care whether or not it’s ideal at this point, as a former fatty who loves to eat it helps me keep me in control of my diet whether I’m cutting, bulking or maintaining. I find it especially helpful with the latter two—when people are like “how could you bulk on IF?” I’m like, um “I like food.”

    I find the leangains macro protocols to be too much for me to follow, but the 16/8 window and Martin’s approach to training have done me a lot of good.
    [hr]
    I don’t, however, think it’s for everybody. I think it’s ideal for people who hear “skip breakfast, have a light lunch and a huge dinner” and think “oh shit, that sounds amazing!” Compliance>Anything else. I’m past the point of caring about what its benefits or drawbacks are. Greg Doucette, whose videos on gear I like, just put out a “IF is terrible!” video and I’m like “whatever, maybe he’s right. It does the job fine for me. If I eat six small meals a day, or don’t have a giant man meal at 7 I’m not gonna be happy and I’m gonna fall of the wagon sooner or later.”
    [/quote]

    Hahah I know the struggle. I even suffer from binge eating disorder and IF keeps it tamed. I get so annoyed hearing people trying IF and complain about being full all the time especially while on a fricken cut.

    I’m surprised about the tren. I thought tren would be the ideal compound for a past fatty like myself. Since it’s notorious for burining so much fat
    [/quote]

    Yeah tren’s amazing, It’s really tough to out eat it. I just found myself needing sugar at some point mid morning.

  • Why would you ever want nutrients out of your blood stream? No nutrients= no growth=loss of muscle. Eating smaller meals throughout the day to reach your caloric goal will always be the best. IF is for morbidly obese people

  • For cutting and maintenance, if it works for you, sure. If you’re trying to get huge it isn’t anywhere near ideal when you could be inducing muscle growth much more frequently by eating every 2 or 3 hours. Can you grow on it? Probably. But you’ll grow much faster eating more frequently throughout the day.

  • [quote=“nlite2k” pid=‘62128’ dateline=‘1563927628’]
    I’ve been doing it for years too. Works fine on gear. The only compound I’ve taken where I had to drop it was superdrol, because it made me go kind of hypo. I just drank a half gallon of fairlife chocolate milk and that took care of me until my usual eating window. I experienced this to a lesser extent on tren, and I’d have to have candy bar or something. It’s not like the world ends, or anything of note, really–happens if you break your arbitrary window.

    I don’t care whether or not it’s ideal at this point, as a former fatty who loves to eat it helps me keep me in control of my diet whether I’m cutting, bulking or maintaining. I find it especially helpful with the latter two—when people are like “how could you bulk on IF?” I’m like, um “I like food.”

    I find the leangains macro protocols to be too much for me to follow, but the 16/8 window and Martin’s approach to training have done me a lot of good.
    [hr]
    I don’t, however, think it’s for everybody. I think it’s ideal for people who hear “skip breakfast, have a light lunch and a huge dinner” and think “oh shit, that sounds amazing!” Compliance>Anything else. I’m past the point of caring about what its benefits or drawbacks are. Greg Doucette, whose videos on gear I like, just put out a “IF is terrible!” video and I’m like “whatever, maybe he’s right. It does the job fine for me. If I eat six small meals a day, or don’t have a giant man meal at 7 I’m not gonna be happy and I’m gonna fall of the wagon sooner or later.”
    [/quote]

    Great post.

    This isn’t god damn rocket science.

    If it helps your adhere to your eating protocol, great. That is the goal. Like he said; the only real worry is about going hypo, and certain compound can extenuate that (like Sdrol). You can either take these compounds and see how you do, change your eating habits so you don’t have to worry about it, or not take these compounds so that you don’t have to worry about it.

    I don’t know how this dissolved to a “You need 6 meals a day, feed the muscles energy, you need protein in your blood for growth” discussion, but here it is. Shows how little people understand about human physiology, how willing they are to pass anecdotes off as fact, and how uninformed they are in general.

    And tbf: we are only talking about seeing effective results on these compounds. The only real deter ant is risking going hypo and mental side effects. Whether you eat 6 meals per day or 3 is going to be small potatoes when you are on 350mg/week of Tren A.

  • [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62062’ dateline=‘1563894156’]
    IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha
    [/quote]

    Say that to Georges St. Pierre. He IF, and I’d say it works for him. I do as well, and it works. I have a friend who totally put his colitis symptoms on ice bc of IF. Nothing helped him prior.

  • [quote=“Webiseb” pid=‘62373’ dateline=‘1564109952’]
    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62062’ dateline=‘1563894156’]
    IF practically means skipping a meal in the morning or evening, that’s all. It’s not really a diet but a tool for appetite control, that’s all. the only meal timing that matters is peri-workout for bodybuilders, please don’t be fascinated by this basic bitch stay at home mum thing anymore, haha
    [/quote]

    Say that to Georges St. Pierre. He IF, and I’d say it works for him. I do as well, and it works. I have a friend who totally put his colitis symptoms on ice bc of IF. Nothing helped him prior.
    [/quote]

    Could you please confirm that you do understand that IF just means to eat your calories in a timeframe that is shorter than what people are accustomed to, and that’s all? Your posts make it sound like it’s some magical tool (which certain fasting protocols like ADF or FMD may be for certain health benefits, IF offers less of the benefits).

    Do you know what works for chinese olympic gold medalists? They don’t get a detailed diet routine beyond ‘eat real food/rice+beef+veggies dishes’ and are allowed to smoke and drink on the weekends.

  • [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62072’ dateline=‘1563900955’]

    BCAA’s are trash so you’re not good at trolling or missed all the memos of the last decade
    [/quote]

    Yeah I’d like a few of these memos. BCAA’s absolutely have their place in bodybuilding and fitness pursuant to individual goals.

  • [quote=“superawesomename” pid=‘62393’ dateline=‘1564123766’]
    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62072’ dateline=‘1563900955’]

    BCAA’s are trash so you’re not good at trolling or missed all the memos of the last decade
    [/quote]

    Yeah I’d like a few of these memos. BCAA’s absolutely have their place in bodybuilding and fitness pursuant to individual goals.
    [/quote]

    They have been generally found to have little effect. “Trash” is probably a bit much, but their performance benefit is going to be significantly less than creatine for most people. And since we are all on AAS here, increasing performance more than what creatine would do is not worth very much. Especially considering a lot of people on gear don’t even bother with creatine anymore. Also, most of BCAA supplementation’s benefits are found on people with low protein diets; I doubt people here are eating less than 1g/kg/day of protein, and if they are, they probably have diet issues that they need to fix that are much bigger than just picking up some BCAAs at GNC.

    Here’s some sources:

    https://examine.com/supplements/branched-chain-amino-acids/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6212987/

    Results have been either mild, inconclusive, or highly individualized and unable to draw an accurate conclusion from.

  • Thanks DNPstoney for replying properly, I couldn’t have been bothered. In a world where animals exist to be eaten there is no place for BCAA’s unless you believe some broscience about protein intake or nutrient timing to begin with

  • [quote=“DNPstoney” pid=‘62403’ dateline=‘1564137445’]
    [quote=“superawesomename” pid=‘62393’ dateline=‘1564123766’]
    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62072’ dateline=‘1563900955’]

    BCAA’s are trash so you’re not good at trolling or missed all the memos of the last decade
    [/quote]

    Yeah I’d like a few of these memos. BCAA’s absolutely have their place in bodybuilding and fitness pursuant to individual goals.
    [/quote]

    They have been generally found to have little effect. “Trash” is probably a bit much, but their performance benefit is going to be significantly less than creatine for most people. And since we are all on AAS here, increasing performance more than what creatine would do is not worth very much. Especially considering a lot of people on gear don’t even bother with creatine anymore. Also, most of BCAA supplementation’s benefits are found on people with low protein diets; I doubt people here are eating less than 1g/kg/day of protein, and if they are, they probably have diet issues that they need to fix that are much bigger than just picking up some BCAAs at GNC.

    Here’s some sources:

    https://examine.com/supplements/branched-chain-amino-acids/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6212987/

    Results have been either mild, inconclusive, or highly individualized and unable to draw an accurate conclusion from.
    [/quote]

    [quote=“appropionate” pid=‘62404’ dateline=‘1564137768’]
    Thanks DNPstoney for replying properly, I couldn’t have been bothered. In a world where animals exist to be eaten there is no place for BCAA’s unless you believe some broscience about protein intake or nutrient timing to begin with
    [/quote]

    So I’m not going just aimlessly read an examine page on things I know about, but I’ll address the specific study you linked.

    [quote]While our results suggest BCAA may aid in the maintenance of isometric muscle function following muscle damage, this ergogenic effect may be trivial as there was no effect on dynamic measures of muscle function. Since the majority of recreational individuals and athletes will most likely engage in subsequent exercise sessions that consist of dynamic movements rather than isometric contractions, the ability of BCAA supplementation to maintain force output during isometric contractions lacks applicability. Therefore, when consumed with a diet consisting of 1.2 g/kg/day protein and presumably higher daily protein intakes, it appears BCAA effects on muscle recovery are negligible[/quote]

    So basically, it’s ineffective because they didn’t have a proper method to test the performance output with which BCAA’s would have and the proper environment. This is a very narrow mindset to be looking at supplementing amino acids in as there are many different applications in just the fitness world. Speaking from experience, and even giving a nod to this study, when on an extremely steep deficit, fasted, with ECY and doing liss BCAA’s were monumental in not only keeping hunger at bay while not imposing an insulin response, but at on a very minimal level helping aid in the prevention of muscle catabolism.

    Sure, in an environment of sufficient protein (not being fasted) and making extreme energy demands (lifting heavy or doing anything really other than liss) they are irrelevant and unneeded because their benefit is being surpassed by actual nutritional energy as opposed to glycogen stores or adipose tissue when nitrogen has been depleted.

    Somewhat relevant study to the effects of leucine post extended fasted periods;

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/659610

    Effect of BCAA on muscle anabolism alone however yeah are shit, yet every study I find concludes that BCAA consumption ALONE will not promote muscle anabolism as it’s rate limited by other essential amino acids. That’s not every single persons goal at all times in the fitness industry.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5461297/

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5568273/

    But again I didn’t say the shit was for everyone. I say it can serve relevant pursuant to individual goals, and as you can read above highly dependent on current energy consumption and expenditure.

    But it’s all just bro science right @“appropionate” ? Or is it nutrient timing and irrelevant because I mentioned being fasted?

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